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[This story contains spoilers from episode eight of The Shards, “Hamlet.”]
Graham Campbell initially auditioned for the role of Bret in The Shards. He wasn’t sure he was right for the starring role played by Igby Rigney, which is a version of author Bret Easton Ellis, who wrote The Shards novel on which Ryan Murphy‘s FX adaptation is based. So he also read for Matt Kellner, the latest victim of the show’s serial killer who is played by Owen Painter., and even Robert Mallory, who is played by Homer Gere.
“What’s so exciting about what we ended up doing with Thom, is that it takes this all-American golden-boy archetype and absolutely blasts it to smithereens,” Campbell tells The Hollywood Reporter about taking on the role of the unassuming yet mysteriously dark boyfriend to prom queen Susan, played by Kaia Gerber. “We take that supposed perfect thing and flip it upside down.”
In the penultimate episode of season one, “Hamlet,” Thom (Campbell) and Susan (Gerber) break up in a scene that Campbell describes as “devastating, violent, vulnerable and scary.” When comparing their tortured relationship to that of the classic saga Romeo & Juliet, Thom, who has been revealed to be in the show’s cult the Riders of the Afterlife, suggests the pair take their own lives together with a steak night over dinner. Susan rejects his offer, breaking things off.
“I told Kaia that I felt like the audience was going to lose Tom,” Campbell shares of his concern about the moment. But his scene partner helped steer him through. “Kaia looked me in the eyes and said, ‘Graham, these are things that you would only say to somebody that you love. You would only fight like this if you really, really had a love to fight for.’ I think it was coming from a place of absolute untethered desperation, feeling that you were going to lose this thing that is the center of your universe.”
Below, in conversation with THR, Campbell unpacks their Shakespearean love story, talks cast chemistry, reveals what he’s been doing on the set of American Horror Story season 13 and shares what he knows about a second season of The Shards: “It’s all really been humbling and a little bit overwhelming,” he says of the show response, and Murphy’s plans to do more seasons.
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Can we start with your casting story. Did you have a chemistry read with Kaia Gerber?
No. But I had known Kaia for a little while before we started working together. Just through the circle, through the scene. Igby and I met in New York and we did a chemistry read, and I just kind of knew. I was like, “I don’t know if I’m going to get this part, but I know for a fact this Igby kid is gonna get it.”
Was Thom the role you wanted from the start?
Actually, originally, I auditioned to play Bret [Igby’s role]. My first tape was for Bret. I thought Bret was an incredible character. I didn’t know necessarily if I was right for it. And then I came in and I read for Matt Kellner for a while, played beautifully by Owen Painter. And I read for Robert [played by Homer Gere]. We were going back and forth and we felt like this made more sense, dynamic-wise.
Ryan [Murphy] is such a genius when it comes to casting. I also think we meet these characters somewhere in the middle, so there’s a lot of each of us represented on screen. I would be hard-pressed to imagine anybody playing any different role.
I understand you are a close cast and that. Ryan told me he hosted cast dinners where he shared what it was like to be this age in the ‘80s, and shared personal stories. How did that period where you were getting close as a cast inform how you played Thom?
It was one of those things where half of the work was done by just getting us all in a room together. We sat down for drinks on a Friday night, and maybe we were shooting that Monday, and the dynamic of the rest of season one just fell into place around the table.
Ryan was helpful in a number of ways. When it comes to casting, he has a really unique ability to see things in people they can’t necessarily see in themselves. He assembles a team based on who his actors are at their core. So I think a lot of the chemistry and alchemy you see on set and on the show really started in his brain with the casting process.
In terms of being a young person in the ’80s, he was an enormous resource. The project is semi-autobiographical for him because he was a young man in 1981. All the cultural references — the music, the clothes, the film, the cigarettes, the sodas, the dance moves — are all things really near and dear to his heart that he wanted to represent as accurately as possible.
There’s a lot of mystery to Thom. We don’t have the full picture of his role with this cult. How did you approach how much you you wanted to hold back, especially going into the season finale?
After episode eight, we’ve learned some pretty serious things about the state of Thom and his mental health and his relationship to himself and to Susan. But I think what’s so exciting about what we ended up doing with the character of Thom is that it takes this all-American golden-boy archetype and absolutely blasts it to smithereens. We take that supposed perfect thing and flip it upside down.
Can you relate to that at all?
Absolutely. Because nobody gets to choose the vessel they walk around in and the family they’re born into, or what kind of car they can or can’t afford. We’re all given something on the outside that people judge us based on. And I would say often, if not always, what’s inside is infinitely more complex. I felt really grateful that Ryan gave me the opportunity, through his writing and his collaboration with me as an actor, to explore the nuanced complexity and underbelly of who Thom was on the inside.
Are Susan and Thom The Shards’ version of Romeo & Juliet? Do you think they’re the most star-crossed love in this show?
That’s an excellent question because I think, if they are Romeo and Juliet, they’re very much The Shards’ version of Romeo and Juliet — in that they’re Bret Easton Ellis’ version of Romeo and Juliet and they’re Ryan Murphy’s version of Romeo and Juliet, which are all versions I would very much like to see. I went a little Shakespeare nuts. I think their trouble comes from the fact that they’re trying to cling onto this Romeo and Juliet ideal that really doesn’t exist, and certainly doesn’t exist in America in 1981. So it’s watching people who are feeling a little bit smothered by thinking they’re meant to be one thing or one way, and not allowing themselves to break out of that.
We saw this scene with you and Bruce this episode, and what we know about this cult is there’s a lot of encouragement to take your own life.
Yes. Whether that’s a metaphor or meant to be taken seriously is sort of up for debate.
What have you filled in about Thom’s role and background with this cult?
Obviously, we have all kinds of answers behind the camera, but I think you’re meant to be trapped in the mystery that Tom is trapped in. When we meet up with Thom and Bruce and we meet up with the cult, it’s a serious moment of feeling very lost, where he’s in search of some kind of purpose, some kind of path. I think that’s all I want to say about that.
How would you describe the headspace you went into for the break up scene with Thom and Susan? It was really intense. Were you portraying that moment as if Thom really was suicidal, or was he threatening Susan as a way to keep her around?
I remember reading it with Kaia. Kaia is a remarkable scene partner who really, really wants to get into the nitty gritty of every term. I told her that I felt like the audience was going to lose Tom [in that scene]. I felt like, until that point, we had rooted for him and wanted what was best for him. I said, “This language is so harsh, and doesn’t feel like something you would say to somebody that you love.” Kaia looked me in the eyes and said, “Graham, these are things that you would only say to somebody that you love. You would only fight like this if you really, really had a love to fight for.” I think it was coming from a place of absolute untethered desperation, feeling that you were going to lose this thing that is the center of your universe.
How sad was that scene for you?
Devastating. Really, really devastating. And luckily, again, I had a scene partner in Kaia, who was willing to go there, and know that we were going to be safe no matter what, but that we wanted to do it justice. It’s a very scary scene. It’s very violent. It’s very vulnerable. And it’s a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for an actor to get to work on a piece of writing like that, especially this early in a career. I wanted to do it well.
How many times did you film that scene, and did you do alts?
We probably filmed it close to 20 times. Somebody was sick or something got pushed from the day before, so we ended up having some extra hours to really get into it. We did it pretty much every which way possible. What you see eventually is some version of all of that cut together, but there’s a great two-shot that I know they were talking about maybe releasing at some point, that was just the two of us doing the scene with no edits, no cuts and one camera. It’s almost like a piece of theater.
How do you shake off of a scene like that?
Honestly, it’s an energetic thing. I went to drama school, so we talked a lot about how to get different energies in and out of your body; how to really bring yourself to an authentic place and flush it out as thoroughly as possible so you can go home and go to bed. But it took a little while. We got a good team for a group hug after it.
Everyone is going through their own stuff amid this central killer on the loose, The Trawler. The episode ends with us questioning: Could it be Robert? Could it be Bret? They have sex and a strange goodbye, which makes you feel like you can’t trust either of them.
Or, did it even really happen? And, do you trust our narrator [Bret]? I think it’s a really effective murder mystery because now I’ve seen it many many times, but I finished the episodes thinking [the killer is] a new person every time.
And you don’t know yet who the killer is yet, right?
We all have our theories. But none have been confirmed. The only one who knows for sure is Mr. Ryan Murphy.
Igby told me that by the finale, people will be either Team Robert or Team Bret. Did you feel that way when you finished the season?
Igby would say that! I don’t think so at all. Your loyalty is so expertly played with in the writing and in the show that you don’t know who you’re rooting for. So I don’t think it’s clear at all. I think that’s the beauty of the novel and of the show.
Is Thom also in play for being The Trawler?
I think everybody’s in play for The Trawler. Everybody’s Trawling, until proven un-Trawley.
Ryan said he and and Bret are planning for this to be three or four seasons and so, to do that, they expanded the story and added characters and storylines that weren’t in the book. What percentage of the book would you say you are up to by the finale?
I’d say we’re about a third of the way through, with the exception of a couple of plot points we felt were important to bring into the second half of this season.
Did you immerse yourself in the book after you got the part, or had you read it before?
It was throughout the audition process, and then I read it after getting the job, and then I went and listened to the audiobook, which is a really, really good way to get a sense of Bret’s voice and writing.
Are there scenes in the book that you’re excited to get to do in a second or third season?
Yes, but I don’t want to say too much! Because you never know what’s going to make it in or what’s not, but I will say that I think we’ve done the show in a way where it’s really a love letter to the book. I also think Ryan has taken it and expanded it into a work of fiction that’s exciting in its own right. I’m equally as excited to tackle things from the book as I am to see what’s new and what comes down the pipeline.
What questions do you have about Thom that you are hoping would get answered in a second season?
I really want to get into the nitty gritty of his relationship with Bruce. It’s deeply complex, and Gus Halper, the actor who plays him, and I were able to get in there and talk a lot about what was going on behind our eyes and what it is we were talking about, the nature of our relationship. I think it’d be nice to explore that origin story.
You had a big episode the night of “Robert’s Party,” between the Bruce scene and the fight on the dance floor, which I understand took place overnight over across five nights of filming.
At about 3 and 4 a.m.
What’s been most challenging for you this season, and what was the wildest/most fun to do?
The break up was the most taxing, just because we had a height we were trying to reach. I felt that we were chipping away as the day went on, and hopefully, eventually landed somewhere exciting. I also always have fun fighting with Homer. He’s a really, really good friend of mine. It’s almost like two puppies scrapping around, so that’s always exciting. When I was younger, I didn’t want to be an actor. I wanted to be a stuntman. So anytime I get to fake hit or fake fall or punch, that’s a dream come true.
Is there anything about getting to play in the ‘80s you’ve brought to your own life?
I’ve been bringing back the popped collar, and non-pretentious sunglasses. There was something really cool about wearing sunglasses in inappropriate settings in the ’80s, and now it’s a major turnoff. I’m trying to bring back some fun-loving sunglassing. A polo shirt and sunglasses were chic, sleek, and cool, and now it’s like, Who does he think he is? Take those off.
You starred on the stage with Sarah Paulson in the Broadway revival of Branden Jacobs-Jenkins’ play Appropriate. American Horror Story feels like a place you two could reunite.
That’s a question for Mr. Murphy, but it’s certainly not out of that question. I’ve been lucky enough so far to only work on things that are really, really well written. So whatever medium it takes me to.
Have you pitched yourself for AHS or any other Ryan Murphy shows yet?
I try to pitch myself to Ryan Murphy every time I look him in the eye. “It’s Graham from The Shards, remember?” (Laughs.) He really keeps it in the family. He has groups of actors he trusts and admires, so it would be the honor of a lifetime to be welcomed into that circle and be able to play with Sarah again. Jessica Lang, Evan Peters. I adore everything he creates, so it would be a blessing to the part of it.
You visited set for the upcoming American Horror Story season 13. Did you get to peep some scenes?
Yes, quite a few. I got to see John Waters work the other day. That was unbelievable.
What are you doing on set?
Just hanging out. We share all kinds of producers and team members and mentors, so they let me come and be a fly on the wall, which I’m very grateful for.
You do look like like you and Evan Peters could be related.
I could play him in some flashbacks now!
What has the fan reaction been like for you with The Shards?
I live back and forth between New York and L.A. But it’s been mostly online, and the fan reaction is that they’ve been so receptive. The fans, who are true fans, are so loyal, and dedicated. They really care for their characters in the way we were hoping people would, and the way we did. So it’s really been humbling and a little bit overwhelming.
Have you heard any whispers about a season two?
No, they don’t tell us any of that until it’s official. So we shall see. We’re just so glad people are responding the way they are. You can never anticipate how something is going to be received, but we really worked our tails off and it’s been amazing to share it with the world.
What are your hopes for Thom as we approach the finale, and as you think about a potential second season?
I hope it gets better. I can’t say necessarily that it will, but I do think he has an enormous heart and a ton of ambition, and he means well. He wants to do good. I hope he can learn how to do so effectively, without pushing other people away.
So don’t give up on him yet.
Don’t ever give up on him, because he’s really trying. Desperately.
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The Shards finale releases Wednesday, Sept. 9 at 9 p.m. ET/6 p.m. PT on FX, streaming on Hulu.
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